Keihin VE65AAWE9 - Fully Explained

[ThePowster]

Evening chaps. Just a lil update so far.

Well I got this ultrasonic cleaner but I think it's faulty. It won't hold temp, it just keeps going skywards. I set it to 40 degrees and it powered on to 60+, so I turned the heat setting off and it climbed to 80 and I stopped it. It's going back.

I noticed the last carb I did had some white stuff all over it, I think it's paint or something, I'm not sure what's gone on with it, but I'm going to clean by hand for the last part.

Now the carb tops had peaks on like icing on Christmas cake, but of rust. So I used the Dremel and a sanding disc to flatten it then I used some steel wool to smooth it down, not perfect as I figured the paint would fill any imperfections.

This is what I was working with: 



And this is what it looked like after 2 licks of paint 😲😎



I could have probably got away with just one coat but they look amazing and with the new stainless hex bolts in there it'll be perfect.

I used this paint:



So next step for me is to paint the float bowls, but when I took them out the ultrasonic cleaner they either have white residue on or paint or enamel has melted or something, I don't know what it is. Tomorrow I'll get wire brush on Dremel and see if it comes off or if it's the coating that's started to come away. Either way she'll get a lick of paint.



The carb bodies will be hard to do because of the choke spring that doesn't seam to come off the body and I don't want to paint that or it'll stick when I operate it, so I'll look at this again tomorrow.

[Bob H]

Well I got this ultrasonic cleaner but I think it's faulty. It won't hold temp, it just keeps going skywards.

Great excuse to return it after your project (if you bought it new).

I bought a cheap one (under $100) that had a heat feature but was very low power heating.
So I heated water on the stove or microwave, and poured it into the ultrasonic cleaner.

A trick I learned from AdvRider was to put small parts in a zip lock bag, and pour in a solution of water mixed with Pine Sol, or Simple Green, or detergent of some sort.

Opinions varied as to how strong of a solution, but the idea is simply to have some help cutting the crud without dumping a gallon of solution to clean small parts. A quart sized freezer bag worked well for me, and you can watch it fill up with cloudy dirt as the ultrasonic runs. Do it again until nothing else seems to be coming off.

[Bob H]

One carb just fits in a quart zip lock that also has the jet holder and other small parts. 1/8 cup Simple Green added to the bag with hot water.
The dirt does come off "like smoke". This 2 1/2 liter unit is very similar to the Harbor Freight ones but I got it from Amazon.

[ThePowster]

Thanka for the post and images Bob 👍

I got my ultrasonic cleaner from Amazon just a few days ago, I've arranged to return it. Even after boiling it for an hour on turbo mode it's still dirty so this unit is just not effective.

I'm going to give it some detailed treatment with a soft brush and some degreaser. After that I've got some small wire pipe cleaners for the passageways. Then it's a lick of paint on the main carb bodies and a new jet kit and a new seal rebuild kit to go in there. Should look better than new.

The float bowl rubber seals were so brittle they just snapped out of there.

Hopefully get the bowls painted today.

[Bob H]

...an hour on turbo mode it's still dirty so this unit is just not effective.

Are you seeing any small vibrations in the liquid? The heat control was defective, but hopefully the vibrating frequency was able to do some magic.

Was there ever any "cloudy" or "smoke" like appearance coming away from the metal?

I ask because the ultrasonic is kind of subtle, and mine was kind of underwhelming at first.
It's not like dipping metal in some sort of acid bath. I used kerosene to pre-clean.

But you want all the help you can get with the internal passages, then use compressed air to blow into every passageway you can find and get air (and liquid) blowing out the other side when you remove it from the ultrasonic.

Especially the passageway to the idle mixture screw. That is not a "straight shot" like some of the main jet orifices, and you want to make sure it's not clogged up in there.

[ThePowster]

Initially I saw vibration and ripples in the water but then I couldn't see any after the 3rd cycle.

Also I used the carb cleaning solution neat and saw afterwards it should have been diluted 1 to 10 eeeekkkk.


Houston... We have a problem 

So I've been looking at my float bowls and as I was observing them I started to see a pattern.

Carb 1 looks clean, carb 2 looks a bit darker in colour, carb 3 darker again and carb 4 almost black.

When I checked the float bowls thinking this black soot and white like salt would just rub off, boy was I wrong.

It seems I've only gone and oxidised them during the ultrasonic process and I'm worried I've totally ruined my carbs 😭

I tried washing up liquid, lime juice, steel wool and nothing was shifting this black. It's like chemically changed the aluminium or something.

In the end I used a Dremel attachment, a silver like metal brush which was corse and I span that over the float bowl and managed to get it silver again, took some effort. But all the nooks and crannies have been oxidised and there is simply no way to get in there to remove it. Chemicals are not touching it.

I have no choice but to leave it or replace the carbs.

So what's worse case ? This oxidisation comes off, then what, blocks jets? That's fine I can clean them. If it doesn't come off then it's just been stained a different colour. Again there isn't much I can do now.

Some pics to show you what kinda a mess I've made.

[Bob H]

Kind of looks like a prior owner spray painted the carbs. What liquid are you putting in the ultrasonic?

Water shouldn't cause a reaction.

[ThePowster]

Carbs hadn't been painted but they was in bad shape with corrosion all over them, now there black almost and the metal has taken some kind of a reaction.

The cleaner I used is at the bottom. I used it undiluted    should have been 10 parts water to 1 part solution.

[Bob H]

The cleaner I used is at the bottom. I used it undiluted    should have been 10 parts water to 1 part solution.

Well that is one way to learn.
Whenever I have poopoo hit the fan, I ask myself what the lesson is to be learned.

"More is not always better" (as the toilet hugging man disposed of his hard liquor)

[ThePowster]

Yep I don't mind what's happened, we only learn from our mistakes, although I'm not exactly sure what I did wrong here as there are so many variables.

I'll keep working at it one delicate step at a time.

[Bob H]

... although I'm not exactly sure what I did wrong here as there are so many variables.

I think the full strength cleaner must have reacted with the metal.
Container says concentrated 10 to 1, and I know pure water would not have turned it black.

The higher than normal heat didn't help, but pure hot water wouldn't do that.

[ThePowster]

Earlier this evening I took the ultrasonic cleaner back out the box (it's going back tomorrow) and I filled it up with the correct ratio and put the furred up black carb in for 50 mins. When I took the carb out the corrosive type white residue that was all over and inside it is 90% gone.

I did the float bowls again but no change on those.

I'm confident now I can get in there and clean the carb bodies and jet ways and save these carbs.

When everything is sorted I'll do some pics and write on them what each part is and where it goes so there will be no confusion for anyone else in the future on how to undertake this job, what size hex head bolts one needs to upgrade and so on.

[ThePowster]

Part 1 - Evening chaps

I am trying to make this post but it keeps coming up server failed so I am not sure whats going on so Ill do it post at a time.

Little update on the carb rebuild then so far.

So I've managed to prep and spray all carb tops and all float bowls now and they are dry and set.

Along with this I have the correct shiny silver stainless hex head bolts to go with it which will look great against the black.

Now with the carb bodies, as I've explained the metal has had some kind of a reaction during the ultrasonic cleaning process and it turned my carbs black this had like changed the chemical structure or something and it oxidised them. Nothing was rubbing this layer off but I found I could use a wire brush on a dremel to remove it.

[ThePowster]

Part II

I tried this on one of my carbs in my kitchen and omg what a mess I'd made.

I had a respirator on and protective eye wear but somehow the fine black dust that the wire brush was bringing off still got black soot in my nostrils and no doubt in my lungs too. Not good. Not only that, every single surface in my kitchen was also covered in the fine black dust particles that came off the carbs with the wire brush. I had to clean every surface and I mean every. It took me 2 days of 4hrs per day to wash all surfaces down and every pot and pan and clean the floor and I had wire strands all over the place that came off the dremel bits. I'd made a right mess. Never again. From now on I do all my work outside.

I'm worried because this black coating is not only on the outside of the carbs but on the inside too and in every pathway. And it's quite a substantial coating which will reduce the fuel ways somewhat and I can't get in there to clean them. I'm hoping fuel will erode it over time. If not I don't see what else I can do. All I can do is try, or buy some new carbs.

Anyway pics so far:

[ThePowster]

The carb on the right is the one I worked on bringing it back to silver again. This took ages and is only half done and it's hard to get in the nooks and crannies.



The good news is my Stage II dynojet kit came into stock today and I had a 20% discount on it and I'll receive that tomorrow.

So this is what dynojet say about the carb kit....

https://dynojet.co.uk/djh-1107.html?find=honda-cb700-750sc-1984-232554

STAGE 2 DETAILS

If you've made slight modifications to your motorcycle, but still crave more performance, a Stage 2 Jet Kit is the solution. With a Stage 2 Jet Kit, you could see power gains of approximately 8%. This kit is intended for bikes with stock or mildly tuned engines using a well - designed aftermarket pipe with a modified airbox and a stock replacement air filter.

So the 1984 CB700 SC makes 80bhp, and the K&N is good for maybe 3-7bhp and is far less restrictive than standard, but let's take the lowly 3bhp figure.

So we're talking a 6.4bhp increase from the stage II jet kit, plus at least another 3bhp minimum from the K&N which should see about a 12%+ increase in total power plus the added snap and driveability and midrange oomph over stock.

I've got Christmas taking up a lot of my time at the moment but after that I'll be outside prepping each carb and giving it a lick of paint and reassemble with the new jet kit and start on installing this and the new K&N system to the bike, doing away with the old airbox and then having to manufacture some kinda new battery housing for the battery then, it'll be play time and I'll be able to confirm what she does in each gear and I'll record it in 4k and we can see how good Dynojet works with the Nighthawk.